The .308 Winchester / 7.62x51mm NATO was created in 1952 and is based on the .300 savage round a round created in 1920. We also think that the more rounds you send down range, fatigue from firing such a powerful round is going to come into play. and the .338 RCM loads 27.4 ft.lbs. There are without a doubt major differences between these two cartridges, and it will be interesting to see how these differences affect the performance characteristics. Typical 200gr .338 Federal factory loads have a trajectory that’s virtually identical to 180gr .308 Winchester factory loads, but the loads for the Federal cartridge also have more kinetic energy all the way out past 500 yards. It’s also capable of using the heaviest bullets of the group. Go with the .358 Winchester or .338 Federal if you want the hardest hitting cartridge. Not surprisingly, all three cartridges have very similar case capacities. In my opinion its the perfect round for the one gun hunter. The pressures listed for the .308 Winchester and .338 Federal above are both measured using the transducer method while the .358 Winchester pressure was measured using the crusher method. It initially gained a reputation as a good “woods cartridge” for hunting medium game. If you do not have the proper rifle twist, you can have the hottest load in the world and be wildly off target. For the rest of the group, the various rounds of each cartridge are interspersed. Recoil energy of the four .338 WM loads averaged 33.6 ft.lbs., the .338-06 loads 27.6 ft.lbs. The .338 LM is a larger caliber than the .308, and regarding cartridge dimensions, the differences in cartridge specs are significant. The original load of a 200gr Silvertip at nearly 2,500fps was significantly more powerful than the .35 Remington and offered a similar level of performance to the heavy hitting .348 Winchester. So we will take a look at the components we can, but keep in mind that there are other factors you will have to take into account. The reason it is so important is that it has a lot of influence on just about every other performance category. This number does not take in to account the bullet design which you will need to keep in mind when we look at the numbers, or the velocity and expansion characteristics. Now that we have taken a look at several performance categories for the .338 Lapua Magnum vs 308 let’s get into how their differences in performance influence which applications they are better suited. I have been looking at these three calibers on an AR platform for my son. I picked up a Ruger American Predator in 358 Winchester this past June, Ruger made a special run of 400 rifles. Finally, the majority of .358 Winchester factory loads shoot bullets in the 180-225 grain range. The .308 Winchester uses .308″ bullets, the .338 Federal uses .338″ bullets, and the .358 Winchester uses .358″ bullets. Numrich Gun Parts Corporation 226 Williams Ln. The .338 LM rounds are leaps and bounds more expensive per round than the .308 Win rounds. For this comparison, we are likely to see a huge difference. We hope you get the chance to experiment with both of these cartridges and all the different ammunition options that are out there. It’s the reason why we think all of these factors should be taken together. Any hunter and any range marksman worth their salt are going to be very in tune with how their cartridge behaves in the air. Though we are not looking at wind drift in this article, we are going to take a look at the short and long range trajectories next. Everyone loves to talk about the ballistic charts and the numbers surrounding their favorite round, but the reality is that most people will never make full use of the effective range of their 5.56 and 9mm, let alone 6.5 Creedmoor or .308 … Perfect bullet expansion. As we wrap up this cartridge comparison between the .338 Lapua Magnum vs .308 Winchester, we want to take just a little bit of space to pick a few individual rounds from each cartridge that we think pairs well with specific applications. It’s amazing what it will do to a bunch of milk jugs lined up. The .308 rounds have a muzzle energy ranging from 2600 to 2900ft.lb. SAAMI has published pressures for the .308 Winchester using both methods, but only has published data using the transducer method with the .338 Federal and only crusher method for the .358 Winchester. Case capacities and reloading data were obtained from Kwk, Hornady (p651 of the 10th Edition Hornady Reloading Manual), and Nosler (here and here). For this comparison, we are going to use the sectional density of the rounds to compare the two cartridges. The 150gr Federal Vital-Shok .308 round does perform more similar to the 280gr Barnes .338 LM round though it still shows slightly more bullet drop. This helps support the blog and allows me to continue to create free content that’s useful to hunters like yourself. Most hunters look for at least 1,000ft.lb of kinetic energy when dealing with whitetail size game. However, the 7.62x51mm and the .308 Winchester both achieved that performance with a much shorter case (51mm vs 63mm) due to advances in powder technology that occurred after the development of the .30-06. What about the claim that the .338 Federal has more muzzle energy than the 7mm Remington Magnum? No extra metal. High BC rounds tend to lose velocity at a much lower rate, and it also plays a big role in the trajectory which we will discuss shortly. Thanks for your comment and for your feedback PJ. One of the main reasons we are always hesitant to try and go about comparing accuracy from one cartridge to the other is the numbers often lack repeatability. Where the .338 LM is really needed as a hunting cartridge is for the largest game animals that require a tremendous amount of energy and penetration to get through thick and tough hides. The .243 Winchester, .260 Remington, and 7mm-08 Remington are among the most popular cartridges descended from the .308 Winchester these days and use a modified .308 Winchester case necked down to 6mm (.243″), 6.5mm (.264″), and 7mm (.284″) respectively. Again, for some of these, the sheer weight of hauling a gun capable of firing these cartridges might make them burdensome in the field. Those bullets are typically not very aerodynamic and are not shot at a very high velocity though. Still, I would not call the recoil objectionable at all. Sectional density doesn’t give us a direct way to determine penetration as say a ballistic gel, but because the bullet weight and caliber are used to determine sectional density, it allows us to compare two cartridge types. While this doesn’t translate directly to accuracy, it does give you an indication that the .338 LM rounds are going to be easier to handle in less than ideal weather conditions, especially at long range. With that in mind, typical .358 Winchester loads have more kinetic energy than typical .308 Winchester hunting loads out to around 100-200 yards, but the faster and more aerodynamic .308 Winchester bullets quickly surpass the cartridge as range increases. I’ll take frontal area and bullet weight over speed any day of the week, and twice on Sunday! We also like Nosler’s AccuBond bullet for punching through really tough hide while still expanding for maximum energy transfer. Think $5 a shot or close to it if you don't reload. Additionally, all three cartridges have basically the same maximum pressure. At the 400 yard mark, we see tightly clustering rounds, but we do start to see the trend of several .338 LM rounds having the flattest trajectory and they maintain this advantage throughout the bullet’s flight. The Lyman 50th Edition (p241-245, 290-291, 311-312), Speer Number 10 (p290-292), and Hornady 10th Edition (p474-484, 650-652, 686-688) reloading manuals were used as references for the history of the cartridges. That same load in the lighter Browning BLR produces 32.51 ft-lbs or free recoil energy, which is closely approaching .300 Win Mag levels. Several more cartridges have been developed using the .308 Winchester as a parent case, some becoming very popular for hunting, particularly in North America. John, They had them at Grice Gun Shop in Pennsylvania, and Grice listed them on GunBroker. Indeed, the .358 Winchester was one of the first cartridges designed using a modified .308 Winchester case while the .338 Federal is a relatively new SAAMI standardized rifle cartridge. When we look at the averages at the 600 and 700-yard mark, the .338 LM rounds show 17″ and 30″ fewer inches of bullet drop on average respectively. X Custom Rifle Introducing the Shaw Mk. While the diameters and cartridge lengths are wider and longer (nearly an inch), the casing material is much thicker for the .338 than the .308 (not shown). The science behind the ballistic coefficient is a great read, and while we are not the ones to dive into the physics and math behind it, anyone with interest in the shooting sports should take a deeper look. Using a .308 Winchester case necked up to use .338″ bullets, the .338 Federal is advertised as having more muzzle energy than the 7mm Remington magnum, and shooting flatter, retaining more energy, and having less recoil than the 30-06. For certain situations, sure, but there will always be some point where one bests the other. Get a good hunting rifle chambered in the cartridge that you think fits your needs the best, learn to shoot it well, use quality bullets, and you’ll be all set for most hunting situations. Although the .338 LM on average has several inches less bullet drop than the .308 Win rounds, there are .308 options out there that can match the short range trajectory performance of some .338 LM rounds. Undeterred by the fate of the .358 Winchester, Federal took a stab at building a new cartridge using a necked up .308 Winchester case in the early 2000s. The .358 Winchester also has more recoil, a more arching trajectory, and less resistance to wind drift than the other two cartridges. With recoil in the 30-40ft.lb range this cartridge can be very uncomfortable for many people to shoot and uncomfortable for just about any of us after a day of it. Thanks for your informative article. I’m not aware of any rifles that are currently manufactured in all three cartridges, so in the interest of making as close to an “apples to apples” comparison as possible, I just decided to make the comparison with a hypothetical rifle that weighs exactly the same for each cartridge. John, I have a tikka t3 in 338 federal and i love it. Best 9mm Ammo 2019 [Self-Defense & Target], 6.5 Creedmoor vs .243 Win – Cartridge Comparison, Best .40 S&W Ammo: Self Defense & Target Practice. Best Concealed Carry Insurance [Comparison Chart]. We are still looking at the bullet drop (inches) for each round but are taking data points out to 700 yards with the firearms zeroed in at 200 yards. What the number tells you is how well a bullet is streamlined. As the bullet moves downrange, it is carrying kinetic energy that is generated from the mass of the bullet as well as its velocity. The Alpha Mags magazines featured in my custom 6.5 Creedmoor will work with that caliber, as well as .308 Win., .260 Rem., 6mm Creedmoor, .22-250, .338 Federal, .450 Bushmaster … and so on. I definitely love this rifle and the recoil is comparable to a 30-06! Hi John, I really enjoyed the article. The situation is similar, but not quite the same with wind drift. As such, it is almost always more powerful and faster than the .30-30 Winchester. The 338 would be really cool however the 358 intrigues me. As far as ballistics go, you’re looking at a ballistic coefficient of 0.789 with only a little over 100 inches of bullet drop at 700 yards. Velocity can also be connected with accuracy, though you should do so with caution. A nice , comprehensive article on these great calibers. Once again, there are even fewer .358″ bullets than .338″ bullets, but there is still a decent selection of them. Energy transfer is not always 100% and how much is transferred also depends on the expansion of the bullet. I usually loaded 250gr Speer Hot Core bullets at max loads. The .308 Winchester was introduced in 1952 and soon after the casing was modified and adopted as the 7.62x51mm NATO round that saw action in Vietnam. This will give us a much better idea of how and when each cartridge might be considered a better option over the other. Indeed, the original 7.62x51mm NATO M80 ball load fired a 146 grain full metal jacket (FMJ) bullet at 2,750 feet per second (2,469 foot pounds of muzzle energy). It has a markedly flatter trajectory and retains more kinetic energy at all ranges than the .358 Winchester. At the 500 mark, we can start to see the trajectories vary from round to round. The 210 tsx flattened a bull moose at around 75 yds. With two decades of chasing all manner of upland game, hooved mammals, strutting gobblers, and any small game that can fit in his Dutch oven, he hopes to offer new ideas and viewpoints on hunting and firearm concepts and traditions. These are the .243 Winchester, the .260 Remington (6.5-08 A-Square), the 7 mm-08 Remington, the .338 Federal, and the .358 Winchester (8.8×51mm). By looking at a wider selection of rounds with varying loads, bullet designs, and weights, we can see if this trend is more general towards the cartridges. So where do we stand with each cartridge? 200-grain Fusions are my medicine of choice, although I will be using their VitalShok rounds this fall. Winchester unveiled the cartridge we now know as the .308 Winchester in 1952. This most likely would occur after firing many shots where you begin to get fatigued. I’m more interested in 185 and 200 grain projectiles so…. These numbers are going to be critical when we reach the 308 vs 338 Lapua Magnum application section. So it’s not even close in the price category. While there are some who can take a .308 and do amazing things with it at these distances, overall the .338 LM is better suited for long range precision shooting. Too many times we see arguments for stopping power, but no one ever mentions that you can have the analytics down, but if you can’t put the round in the bread basket, those numbers don’t mean a whole lot. 3 Places To Buy Guns Online, And A Few Tips To Help. All that being said, the .338 Federal and .308 Winchester both have the same published maximum average pressure of 62,000 psi using the transducer method. 150 grain, 165 grain, 168 grain, and 180 grain bullets are by far the most common. I have carried a Ruger Hawkeye in .358 with me in the field for the last 11 years. Thanks for your comment Matthew. Strong recoil like this can be mitigated with the use of properly designed stocks and recoil pads. The box rated them for 2700 fps but I’m actually getting 2750 consistently. Most loads for the cartridge also carry more energy downrange than typical .358 Winchester loads, but not quite as much as the .338 Federal. .338 Federal ammo and .358 Winchester ammo are MUCH less common than .308 Winchester ammo. And the Federal round is much gentler in recoil. Bought my second .338 Federal this spring and chronographed the 200 grain Fusions. To be honest, there are going to be very few times where you sit and wonder should you go with a .338 or .308 chambered rifle, at least in the hunting world. When we look at the averages at the 600 and 700-yard mark, the .338 LM rounds show 17″ and 30″ fewer inches of bullet drop on average respectively. .338 Federal.358 Winchester; 45 Raptor; 7mm-08 Remington; Because it shoots with great accuracy and recoil is manageable, police and military shooters consider the .308 Winchester to be a valuable component in their arsenals. When calculating the sectional density, Bullet B will have a higher SD than Bullet A because of the increase in weight. With interest in the .338 LM in civilian circles, there are more options for the cartridge than there once was, but you are still going to have more difficulty finding it when compared to other cartridges. With the longevity of the cartridge’s popularity, though it might not be as prevalent as it once was, there is still plenty of options for ammunition with several nearly always available at a retail store that carries ammo. As you can see, both .358 Winchester loads drift in the wind a whole lot more than the .308 Winchester or .338 Federal loads. Pour la chasse … (.358) 225 gr Nosler Partition (cerfs élaphes, sangliers, ours bruns, …) For that, we have to dive into hand loading rounds, and that is better served in a separate article. Assuming both bullets have the same design and velocities, Bullet B should provide deeper penetration because there is more weight and force being localized to the same area as Bullet A. Pour le stand … des Speer de 158 gr (.357). Top 3 Reasons To Try the .338 Federal on Your Next Hunt. The velocity of a round is an important component to examine when comparing two cartridges or just looking at any cartridge for that matter. THE BEST GUN DEALS AND HANDPICKED GEAR RECOMMENDATIONS, Subscribe to our Newsletter and we send you the best deals right into your inbox. While the savvy people at Federal might be expected to field a practical cartridge every so often, I was astonished that this one showed up as an orphan. Should work great for elk, limited to 250 yards or so. John, J’ai craqué pour le 358 Win. When looking at the 338 Lapua vs 308, we have to keep in mind that both of these cartridges can have their day in the sun. The cartridge has more than enough stopping power for medium sized game such as deer out to 500 yards and elk out 300 yards efficiently. What we mean is that this data is not going to give you an idea of the maximum performance that can be extracted from either cartridge. However, the newer cartridges used a significantly smaller package. And with this rounds ballistic coefficient and it’s trajectory, there is no issue with shots out at 500 yards. The .308 is a fairly popular medium to large size game in North America and has been so for decades. This energy damages and destroys surrounding tissue and organs. A lightweight .300 Win. And again, these are not the only parts to the full equation. This cartridge is much younger when compared to the other cartridge we will look at, but it is interesting because it is sometimes seen as a replacement for the .308 Win in specific shooting applications. We will first look at the short range trajectories of the ten selected rounds. Sniper Country is reader-supported. If you compare individual rounds, the flattest .338 LM round shows nearly 40″ less bullet drop at 600 rounds compared to the steepest falling .308 Win round and 56″ less drop at 700 yards. Even though the .338 cartridges have some incredible BCs (0.789 and 0.72), you can see that it does have some rounds that closer resembles the BCs of the .308 Win cartridges and even less than a few of them (0.431 < 0.45, 0.462). I am really surprised that it hasn’t garnered more attention. We have compiled the BCs for the ten rounds we have selected for comparison and placed them in a bar graph (Graph 3). Over the years, Ruger, Kimber, and Tikka (among others) have all produced rifles in that chambering. Best .300 Win Mag Ammo For Hunting Elk, Deer & Other Big Game, 6.5 Grendel vs 5.56/223: Review & Comparison, Best 308 Ammo For Hunting Deer, Elk, Hogs, & Other Game, Best 7mm-08 Ammo For Hunting Elk, Deer & Other Game, 6.5 Creedmoor vs 300 Win Mag Review & Comparison, Best 7mm Rem Mag Ammo For Hunting Elk, Deer & Other Game, 6.5 Creedmoor vs 243 Winchester Review & Comparison, 6.5 Creedmoor vs 7mm-08 Remington Review & Comparison, 6.5 Grendel vs 308: Everything You Need To Know, Essential Muzzleloader Supplies Every Hunter Needs In 2021, The 300 Ultra Mag (300 RUM): Your Complete Guide, 6.8 SPC vs 6.5 Grendel: What You Need To Know. Maybe one day, I’ll have a .338 Federal in the safe? Because the .308 Winchester ammo is a newer cartridge (developed in the 1950’s), it has the advantage of advanced materials and designs. On the other hand, the .338 Federal factory ammo is normally offered with either 185 grain or 200 grain bullets. is still cooking along at 1,800 fps all the way out to 680 yards. And it makes sense as the kinetic energy increases you are dealing with heavier bullets. The reason why penetration is essential is it determines the rounds ability to reach critical organs. It is very obvious that we are looking at two different cartridges in this comparison. Having this brief experience with the cartridge has planted me firm in the .35 cal camp. This is illustrated in the table below comparing Buffalo Bore, Federal Fusion, and Hornady factory ammunition loaded with 150gr (.414 BC) and 180gr (.503 BC) Fusion Soft Point bullets in .308 Winchester, 200gr Fusion Soft Point bullets (.416 BC) in .338 Federal, and 200gr InterLock Soft Point (.282 BC) bullets and 225 gr Barnes Triple Shock X (TSX) bullets (.359 BC) in .358 Winchester. The .358 Winchester uses the largest diameter bullets of the bunch and has a frontal surface area of .1007 square inches. Though they each have their limitations, both cartridges offer certain advantages when compared to their parent cartridge. These are also factory loads, so you are going to be looking at factory load performances. Make sure you subscribe to The Big Game Hunting Podcast and follow The Big Game Hunting Blog on Facebook, Instagram, Twitter, and YouTube. Are you a handloader? You might have a superhuman ability to place accurate shots under heavy recoil. We are completely aware that this is not by any means a comprehensive list given the amount of options available, but the sake of brevity, we have to limit our selections. You have to go with what you need or look for alternatives to the situation at hand. At the 300 yard mark, we do see a little more distinction between the individual rounds. Do you want a cartridge well suited to hunt large game like elk, moose, red stag, or kudu in North American or on an Africa or New Zealand hunting safari? Its range and power have also made it popular for big and dangerous game. Unless you are highly trained in the use of the rifle and have logged a couple hundred hours, the recoil of the .338 Lapua Magnum is going to be in the back of your mind when lining up a shot. Receive our newsletter with the best articles covering guides, guns & gear. The 180 grain .308 Winchester load comes out on top here, followed by the 150 grain .308 Winchester load, which is in turn followed closely by the .338 Federal load. However, the .338 Federal and .358 Winchester are also well designed short action cartridges descended from the .308, but are not nearly as well known. .338 Federal based on the .308 winchester is not in the same class as the other two. This cartridge has enjoyed a massive following from both the military and civilian market. For that reason, pretty much every ammunition manufacturer of note like Barnes, Browning, Federal Premium, Fiocchi, Hornady, Nosler, Remington, Swift, Weatherby, and Winchester (just to name a few) produces a wide variety of ammo for the .308 Win. Looking at this section, you most likely fall into one of two categories; you either are well aware of the ballistic coefficient or you have never even heard the term. The .338 LM rounds have nearly or over double the recoil energy generated when compared to all of the .308 Win rounds. The reason for this is all the factors that go into accuracy including the environment and the user. The .308 Winchester is by far the most popular out of the bunch. This is a significant advantage for the .338 Federal vs the .308 Winchester and an even bigger advantage for the .358 Winchester. We compiled the velocities (ft/s) from the muzzle out to 500 yards from the manufacturers’ websites (Graph 2). And we mean long, long-range shooting. Sporting usage While data gathered in this method provides an accurate means of comparison, we want to make clear that the numbers can vary when used with your shooting platform.